Saturday, December 20, 2008

White stuff..

It looks like we may well have a white Christmas in Portland this year. Schools were closed all week long, and while it's easy to laugh at that when you come from Finland ("if it's colder than -20°C, you don't have to go outside for recess, and can do PE inside"), it's rather understandable when most years you only get a day or two of snow.

Here's a plant in our back yard. But don't ask me what it is. I strictly sort plants by "edible" and "not edible", and I think this one falls in the second category.

And I find I like snow when I know it's not going to stay much longer, and it only happens once a year or so.


Anonymous said...

I have to point this out as a Portland native because so many people are desperately out of touch when it comes to snow in this area (you included, it seems).

The midwest, and you, are used to dry snow. Such a thing is extremely rare here, west of the Cascades and east of the Appalachains tend to get very wet snow, with thick layers of near-freezing (and thus water-covered, therefore tractionless) ice. It's not the snow that shuts us down, it's the ice.

Snowplows can't break it up (or they'd be iceplows, wouldn't they?), so about the only thing you can do is chain up, dump craploads of beachsand and cheesebrine on it and hope for the best.

Also, this is a normal winter for us. We haven't had an average winter for about 15 years now, so this is a nice return to the kind of winter that reminds Californian tourists to go home when they're done visiting.

Linus said...

Baloo: you really think that nobody else has days when the weather is wet and freezes over?

Hint: when you have winters with -20°C for a couple of weeks, what do you think it is like before (or after) it turns cold and dies up?

Hmm? Think about it for a while there.

Anonymous said...

My point being is that places with dry snow only get the really nasty tractionless conditions for a few hours to a day during the thaw, not the entire storm as is typical here. With six inches of snow on the ground in Eastern Oregon, I can drive a PT Cruiser down the highway without chains on no-problem. Same conditions westside, and I'd have to chain up if it's happening at all.

Entirely different kinds of snow.

Linus said...

Baloo: ..and when it's sunny and dry, anybody can drive. You're missing the point, or just in denial.

You seem to think that it's just here that you get a few days of icy weather. Not so. It happens in other places too. It happens more in other places.

The fact that those other places also get even colder weather (which is easier) is totally and utterly irrelevant.

I don't recall ever having seen a "snow day" in all my years in Finland. And trust me, there's a lot of miserable weather there. But people have studs (or these days, traction tires), and it's not optional - it's the law. Life goes on.

Exactly because other places have more of those icy conditions than Portland has. They have to cope. Portland can choose to just shut down instead.

And don't get me wrong: it's even the rational choice - it's just not realistic to have the needed infrastructure in place for just a couple of days a year. Portland doesn't have enough plows and sanding equipment (and boxes of sand by the wayside etc). And it wouldn't make economic sense to do so.

But then being defensive and trying to claim that Portland is special and gets ice like no other place gets - that's just silly.

Got it?

Anonymous said...

I'm not saying that Portland is special, just that places that remain at or near the freezing point when it's icy are more slippery than places that get colder. Places between the ocean and the first set of substantial mountains falls into this category. Even Anchorage, Alaska shuts down for ice storms like Portland does, while it's business as usual for snowstorms.

That's not being in denial, that's basic physics and meteorological fact.

LegoAddict said...

I'm from one of those other places that gets more snow ;)

This is nothing new for us; I live in Kingston, Ontario (near Ottawa) and EnvironmentCanada just called our recent little dump "Snowmageddon" in official documents. Being both at the mouth of the St. Lawrence River and Lake Ontario, we got the worst of it in Eastern Ontario... It was drier than usual (we usually get alot of very wet snow) but it was a doozie with -35 including windchill. Kingston is supposedly more temperate than other parts of Ontario, but I'm calling everyone who says that a liar today.

@ Baloo - Canadian snowplows take up tonnes of the heavy stuff every year. Maybe we're just more used to it (They don't even HAVE snowplows in southern BC... I wouldn't think Oregon would have much of them either)

Our streets are regularly turned into skating rinks (there's always a game of hockey on King Street infront of City Hall) and our drivers don't really have a problem. Winter tires (rarely chains) and alot of snowplows take care of the heavy stuff.

If you think the US West Coast is bad for snow in terms of awfulness, look at poor Newfieland and Nova Scotia. They get wholloped with wet snow regularly.

As for snow days, I get them regularly because I bus into Kingston's old, cramped, narrow-roaded, downhill downtown from the outskirts. My little brother, however, has to walk to the Catholic school half a klick away no matter what the weather,

Anonymous said...

@LegoAddict: That's not true, while Vancouver, BC is warmer and dryer than western Oregon, most of southern BC is quite mountainous and I've spotted snowplows parked in gravel yards along TC-1 and BC-99 before. Some Vancouver suburbs have their own snowplows, such as Anmore, are substantially higher and get snowfall when the rest of greater Vancouver is getting rain. And please read my comments for comprehension: I said all coastal regions are prone to this phenomenon, which is consistant with what you're saying about Nova Scotia.

LegoAddict said...

You are correct; let me clarify Southern BC with Vancouver Mainland and Vancouver Island. They rarely if ever see snow in a year.

However, The Maritimes get the ice storms and blizzards all the time. It's pretty constant out there. My mother is a Nova Scotian and she has pictures of snow drifts completely obscuring most of her house.

Much worse than you could get in coastal Oregon.

Lynne said...

Can't we all just get along? Snowball fight? Dry ice fight? :-)

Linus said...

Baloo: you say "places that remain at or near the freezing point when it's icy are more slippery than places that get colder."

Take a deep breadth, and use your brain for a while.

What do you think the average temperature in Helsinki (to take one example I'm used to) is during late November and early December?

Hint: that's not when it will be -20°C.

Hint: that's a whole month of exactly that "near freezing" weather than Portland gets for a few days of the year.

Put them all together. What do you think happens during the night, when it gets colder than average? What do you think happens during the day?

You throw big words around ("basic physics and meteorological fact"), but you seem to think it only really affects Portland, and other places don't have fancy stuff like that.

But other places do have both basic physics and meteorological facts. And they don't shut down like Portland does.

Stop concentrating on the fact that there are also colder months (like February). How hard is it to understand? Those places that get colder than Portland do not get colder over-night. And they stay near the freezing point much longer than the occasional winter storm.

And you can talk about "ice storms" all you like and compare Portland to Anchorage, but take it from me: what Portland calls a "storm" is just regular weather in other places. I can pretty much guarantee that the things that shut down Anchorage are a hell of a lot worse than anybody has ever seen in Portland.

So next time somebody laughs at Portland shutting down for a few inches of snow and ice, how about giving them the benefit of the doubt, and admitting that maybe other places really do have worse weather? Instead of trying to convince them about how Portland is doing all it can to just survive, exactly like Anchorage?

Gaah. This really wasn't meant to be about Portland being silly. But you turned it into that - by trying to make Portland weather sound so extreme.

pianoprincess said...

awesome,"edible n not edible category!^__^

Wendy said...

I think you should run a contest for guessing this plant. :) Well, I'm guessing anyway, contest or not: Japanese Maple?

(Nice subject change anyway!)

Unknown said...

I'm from Wisconsin and for the last two winters (which seem to being well before the official Dec. 21 date) we have had great amounts of snow. Some of it is dry and fluffy and some of it is heavy and wet and the roads remains slippery for more than a few hours.

Since the Eskimos have many words for snow so I suppose it is true snow is different each storm; however, when you get snow in a place not used to it, the impact is much greater than those of us used to snow. I suppose the "sport" of contending one's area gets more snow than another and to contend that one knows more about snow than another sounds like the sport of someone without much life outside the snow!

Thanks for the enjoyable snow discussions! A hearty hello from Wisconsin -- the people who invented the snowbowl.

David Berg said...

I was raised in the northern tip of Delaware, and my fondest memory of snow was the March '93 blizzard that they nicknamed the "Storm of the Century." We got over 3 feet of snow, and this was back when I was only about 7, so it was up to my neck. It was one of the only times I remember actually being snowed in; seeing it piled halfway up the height of the back door is a vivid memory. I wanted so bad to open the door to see if the snow would avalanche into our living room, like it did in cartoons, but I think the snow was wet enough that it wouldn't have budged.

Now I'm in balmy North Carolina. I think this is the only place it hasn't snowed in the US so far...

littlegirllost said...

for the last two days it has been in the 70'S here in east Texas. i think tonight it is going to be 30. but christmas day it is supposed to be 78. no white christmas here.

Anonymous said...

Funnily enough, weather forecasts promise no snow for this xmas in Helsinki area (mustajoulu, that is).

Anonymous said...

"Since the Eskimos have many words for snow"

rosedale's 4head said...

I live in Texas, born and raised, lived 12 years in California, but there is NO place in the US quite like my region. Within the last two weeks we've gone from low to mid 70s to freezing 30s. We're pretty much one of the few places that can drop 40 degrees within a day, with hours. That's something to write home about.

Linus, your blog is intriguing. Again, thanks for sharing!

Anonymous said...

@jenn's mama: You might think so being californian, but to the rest of us who have experienced weather before, it's not totally unheard of. Most of the Pacific Northwest has similar temperature swings just between the day's low and the day's high in april and may.

Anonymous said...

@Linus: If you're so extreme and hardcore about weather and think we're wusses about it, have you considered leaving Oregon? Love it or GTFO.

JaY said...

Looks like moss.... spagnum moss to me.. not much of a plant. More of a fungi.

Linus I often think the same thing... All I can say is my car doesn't think the way I do. Maybe I should get a open source car that can be improved with community support of course :).

Antti Alfred Vikman said...

@Linus: You said that it's near freezing in Helsinki for Nov. and Dec. I think you haven't spend winters in Finland for a while, now days it's that the whole winter.

LGB said...

Se on kylmempi kuin kotonasi Euroopassa? Sorry I try to learn Finnish for a while :-)

virvan said...

Guys, Linux is ethnically Swedish, so stop showing him how smart your a$$e$ are in Finnish :)

virvan said...

oops, Linus, not Linux

Anonymous said...

I've never been snow and I'm not crying like baby pansies. I think we are distorted the post and not say. I wish you happy Christmas! Linus and excellent new year

mavq said...

I would like to see snowing once in my life:/

One Voice said...

I would love some snow for my little one to go out in and enjoy :-) (and me being a big kid inside would have to go out there with him ;-D). All we seem to grt is rain :-(

Arin said...

Snow? What is that?

Anyway, in Southern California, all we've got is rain. Where are the songs about a WET christmas?

Just kidding... Good luck with the weather, hope anybody in it can get their car out.

LGB said...

Well I read that Linus speaks both of Finnish and Swedish at mother language level. Anyway I can speak some Norwegian too, but it's still not Swedish but there are so much similarities, indeed. ;)

.:GnOmE:. said...

hi Linus,
i wish you a merry christmas and a happy new year!
marco from germany

Anonymous said...

@Arin: You do know that "White Christmas" is about a man living in Beverly Hills lamenting the lack of weather in California, right?

Amy Lear said...

You know, I'm reminded of when I first moved to Arizona from the east coast..

Everyone made a BIG deal about 'monsoon season', and how I'd need to be careful during it.

So when fall rolled around, and it started raining I was all, "Cool. Water." And I asked some folks, "So when do the monsoons start?"

I got stared at by the group, and was told in a tone that made it clear they felt it was obvious, "This IS the monsoon season. Didn't you see it on the way to the office?"

"... I just saw rain. It's kind of like spring showers out there."

It's all a matter of perspective...

Alan said...

I have lived in Portland for 30 years. We have never had this much snow, contrary to what Baloo Uriza claims. Furthermore, we have not had 30 mph winds blowing the snow around either.

It is not a "normal winter".

It all depends on what you are prepared for and used to.

I used to live in Fairbanks Alaska. We had -60 degree winters. We also had parkas and other proper clothing for the weather and the facilities to deal with it. (We also did not get 30mph winds to go with the weather either.) People were acclimatised to the weather as well. (Seeing kids walk home from school with no coats on in 20 degree weather is normal around March. The parkas are to hot to wear and it is warm compared to the previous month.)

This kind of weather in pretty rare in Portland. We get a few days of snow a year. It rarely lasts more than a few days. It is far too expensive to keep the kind of equipment it takes to deal with cleaning up the roads for just a few days a year.

But the weather also give some the excuse of being a jerk to people who are viewed as "outsiders" and/or "non-Oregonians". Ignore them. They just crave attention and miss a non-existent past when the Californians did not drive up the land prices and the people from Washington did not cross the border to escape the Washington sales tax.

rosedale's 4head said...

@Baloo Uriza: I lived in California but no longer. I'm a Texas native and currently reside here. There literally is no place like Texas. Other states at least have distinctive seasons. We don't. One day you might need an overcoat, the next day you're sweating and in a tank. Have you ever been to Texas? If so, what was your experience like? If not, no inclimate experience is like ours. Sorry.

Elisa sanoo oo... said...

Hienoa että saatte viettää valkoista joulua! Luin sun elämänkerran kesällä ja sen jälkeen tuntuu kuin tuntisin sut aika hyvin, paremmin kuin jotkut kaverini ;). Eli hyvää joulua vaan teidän perheelle, oli mukava juttu löytää sun blogisi :).

Anonymous said...

@Alan: I can remember getting this much snow in Beaverton in 1992, 1994, 1996 and 1999. Getting 5-25" of snow is normal for the Willamette Valley in winter, even according to the National Weather Service. If Jim Bosley or Rod Anders were still alive instead of all these out-of-state weathermen we have now, they'd tell you the same exact thing. What's different about this is the duration. Usually it lasts half a week to a week. That's the only big difference.

Unknown said...

We in Serbia do have snow, but not much this year...New Year is not same withou snow, so I like it... :D

Demented Chihuahua said...

I just moved up from Klamath Falls in southern Oregon to Portland. Last year in Klamath we had 3 ft of snow, most in like the last 15 to 20 years. Now we have a massive dump of snow--by portland standards--and its one of the worst on record for here! Will the crazy weather never end for me!

gnumber9 said...

Dave, I live in Farmville, NC an hour 45 from the coast and it's snowed twice. Not heavy snow nor did it stick. But yes it's been a balmy December, tomorrow 70 and Sunday 75!

NC mountains are the highest on the East Coast and they get plenty. I miss them. Appalachian State University only closes it's doors at -40 degrees, that's F or C if you need to know. I went there and one day I skipped class when it was -39.

Is that Hemlock? Not the herb, but the conifer. Hemlock's an ever green, but it looks like it.

Chris Handwerker said...

I normally like snow and winter weather but that ice storm we got in Massachusetts sucked. No power for 18 days! I'm still without internet (im connecting through my cell phone). I'm waiting for internet to come back so I can install Linux on my snazzy new laptop :-)

a very random person said...

darn moo. DARN MOO!!!!!!!!!
you are lucky I have never seen snow, but I hope too one day. Along with making the world' biggest meatball, uhhhhhh(drools on keyborad)

vebov said...

Happy Birthday! Let health and good luck will be with you

Марина Бернацкая said...

Happy Birthday!
С Днем Рождения!

Anonymous said...

Happy Birthday, Linus! :)

Александр said...

Happy Birthday, Linus!!! Thank you for Linux and OpenSource works!!!

Anonymous said...

Happy Birthday, Linus!!
I love you for you code!!


with love, Grawl.

Anonymous said...

Hey Linus, we all thank you for a better world :)

Ууганбаатар said...

happy birthday!!! linus torvalds))))

Dario Cavedon said...

Never too late to say: HAPPY BIRTHDAY! :-)

Anonymous said...

Have a Merry Christmas and Happy New Years!

Travis McCrea said...

@Baloo Uriza Your very intense, maybe you need to get over yourself?


I have been reading through your blog, its very neat seeing someone as high profile as you (although you seem to be a High Profile guy, living in a Low Profile mindset), just sharing your thoughts.

Living in North Idaho, we are in an area where it snows a lot (a few feet a day sometimes during this winter) we probaly only lost a couple school days to snow this year.

I always find it funny when larger cities SHUT DOWN because of a HALF INCH of snow... seriously... a half inch hardly even affects your driving. Its more the "IDEA" that it affects your driving more thant enything.

Keep on writing awesomeness

Amy Jo said...

Try living in MIchigan. Snow snow snow. I wonder daily what I am still doing here. I am moving in July to chicago-somewhere just as cold woohoo. What am i thinking. I like sm\now for chirstmas and pretty much thats it

Clifford said...

Oh the meaningless banter Baloo Uriza. Perhaps you can drive in the snow better than everyone else? I intended on reading through the comments simply because it is pretty rare for Oregon to see so much snow. My nieces and nephews were stuck at home for their snow day as well.

I can tell you for sure that think freezing layers of non-tractionless scary as hell ICE shows up here in Eastern Idaho as well. Of course we are not in the Cascades or Appalachians so our snow must be dry even though it is made up of H20. The powdery fluff just blows right off the roads, right?

I think I'm done feeding the snow troll...

Happy belated birthday Linus!

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